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May 19, 2008 8:36 AM PDT

Microsoft: Vista is so misunderstood!

by Matt Asay
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The Register has a great article deconstructing Microsoft's "Five Misunderstandings about Vista" (Recently pulled down, but not before The Register captured the document.)

Apparently, Vista has been slow out of the gate because it's misunderstood in five key areas: 1) User Account Control, 2) Image Management, 3) Display Driver Model, 4) Windows Search, and 5) 64-bit architecture.

Please join me in shedding a tear for Redmond....

Whatever the validity of Microsoft's five-point discussion (and The Register largely rips these up), the biggest problem with Vista's adoption doesn't even make the list: Performance:

What about performance? In my view, this is far and away the primary problem users have with Vista. It is not in any sense a misunderstanding, however Microsoft spins it. It is bewilderment: why does my new machine, which should be fast, spend so much time spinning its little bagel when I want to get on with my work?

Amen. The reality is that Vista is almost certainly not as bad as detractors suggest (myself included), nor as good and faultless as Microsoft suggests. Regardless, Microsoft may have to wait until Windows 7 to redeem itself. Will it be too late?

Matt Asay brings a decade of in-the-trenches open-source business and legal experience to The Open Road, with an emphasis on emerging open-source business strategies and opportunities. Matt is vice president of business development at Alfresco, a company that develops open-source software for content management. He is a member of the CNET Blog Network and is not an employee of CNET. Disclosure. You can follow Matt on Twitter @mjasay.
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Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 4 pages (134 Comments)
by KinetiK_SK8R May 19, 2008 11:13 AM PDT
Vista is a dog. Take the fleas off a dog and it is still a dog. I have used Microsoft products for years and years, but this one is a real loser. I think it would gain Microsoft so much good PR if they would just in some way admit that they screwed up, and that they will continue to offer XP as long as customers prefer it. I personally feel that they should have invested all that time, effort, and money into making XP even better. The public would probably have been more willing to pay a reasonable amount for an even better upgrade of XP. Plus, I am beginning to have a problem with the amount of control they actually have over what goes on in the industry.
Reply to this comment
by Lerianis May 20, 2008 2:42 PM PDT
Vista is not a dog. Frankly, on a computer with REASONABLE SPECS (over 1GB of memory), it is faster than Windows XP Media Center Edition or Professional.
The only people who have problems with it are people who either have not used it, or who have unreasonable expectations of speed.
Now, I will be the first to say that Vista is a memory hog....... but Microsoft is trying to fix that. The same accusations were also leveled at XP when it first came out, but once computers were updated and upgraded a year after it was released...... those accusations disappeared.
by jimsberg May 24, 2008 8:32 AM PDT
Right on except that when my XP/Dell peters out I'll be going to MAC.
by phimil May 24, 2008 1:45 PM PDT
I don't understand users hate for Vista. it outperforms all previous versions.Vista does a lot of nice things, and I have never suffered any real performance issues. People get so brainwashed from the media they can't see past what the news says. I've enjoyed vista since it came out and will continue to promote it. If your having performance issues, get a better computer. it is by far way better than xp more stable.I find that Vista is by far one of the most efficient versions to date
by b8375629 May 26, 2008 7:02 AM PDT
People who insist on defending Vista are the same ones who wasted their money on it in the first place but because of pride & ego, won't admit that there is a kernel of truth about why it gets the reputation it deserves.

My experience with Vista?

a) Never buy the upgrade. It runs like crap on P4s and Pentium M's (with 1 - 2GB of RAM) that are only a couple of years old. Forget about Celerons and low powered laptops. Oh I'm sure some shill out there will say they got it done, but most of the people I've read have had a dog on their hands. Same as me.

b) Never trust the "Vista-Capable" sticker you see on so many machines. It's a load of bull

c) Never trust M$ upgrade advisory tool. Ya know, the one I foolishly downloaded onto my 2 year old XP machine to see which version of Vista it will take. Well I did that and I was wrong. Fortunately I ghosted my C:\ so I'm back in business, but I'm still out $150.

Any complaints about XP six years ago pretty much died out after the first 6 months. It's now a year and a half since Vista came out and still no end to the criticism. That says a lot.
by aaroberts May 19, 2008 1:05 PM PDT
The problem with Vista is that it sucks! 750 meg consumed just sitting there!

I'm a microsoft fan. I've been running windows since Windows 2.0. Vista is just terrible and I rue the day I'll have to install it because support has been pulled on XP.
Reply to this comment
by phimil May 24, 2008 1:48 PM PDT
If your having performance issues, get a better computer vista is the best
by Fordry04 May 26, 2008 6:23 PM PDT
you do realize that vista uses as much memory as it can all the time, and when another application is launched vista gives that app all the ram it needs. Seriously, is there something wrong with it using that? how much do you have? how expensive is it to go upgrade?
by wfoss May 20, 2008 4:59 AM PDT
I don't understand users hate for Vista. Is it because you can afford only vista basic?

Vista does a lot of nice things, as it states in the magazine and I have never suffered any real performance issues. People get so brainwashed from the media they can't see past what the news says.

I've enjoyed vista since it came out and will continue to promote it.

If your having performance issues, get a better computer. Or maybe perhaps we should always stick with celeron processors and 512 mb ram and build operating systems around that. Go linux if you have an issue
Reply to this comment
by pinkfluffydice May 20, 2008 1:46 PM PDT
way to go man - i totally love vista - even though I only have home premium LOL - but vista is the way forward and for all that numbnuts who hate it - they have probably only used it for not more than 3 months as it did have problems at the start but its even better now that service pack one is available - remember xp - service packs also - windows 2000 - service packs - thats whats wrong with these people - they have no patience and prefer to follow all the bad press cos likin vista is not cool at the moment - wait til it is and we can laugh in their faces lol :-P
by giuliocesare May 26, 2008 10:42 PM PDT
I agree with you completely! Vista is a great OS. I did have some problems with it when I first installed it. But I got acquainted with what is new, and now I really like Vista. The hatred that so many people have for Vista is really brainwashing from the media, I agree.
by gstern1994 May 20, 2008 6:07 AM PDT
I completely agree. I used XP since it came out and now I've moved onto Vista. I am a web developer and I've noticed a significant bump in the "snappyness" factor of my web apps (Dreamweaver/Fireworks/Photoshop). Rendering, editing and a myriad of other activities are far quicker in my view. Even when my XP machine was new, it did not have the zip my vVsta machine has with comparably the same hardware/memory. Sure there are glitches, but overall I'm more than satisfied. People dislike change and XP is a tried and true product so I think it's only natural that many people are griping.

I cannot speak to a poorly configured pc as mine seems to be optimally configured (hp2050). I would imagine any pc, regardless of the OS, if poorly configured would run like a dog.
Reply to this comment
by Fordry04 May 26, 2008 6:24 PM PDT
amen to that, lol.
by TheeBadOne May 20, 2008 6:21 AM PDT
Windows user my entire life. I edit photos. Vista is a performance DOG. Why would anyone who uses their computer for REAL work (not surfing, not word processing, but REAL work such as Photoshop/CAD work) want Vista on their new Dual/Quad-Core computer? It would be akin to buying a Ferrari, and hooking up a 1,000 lb trailer to it...
For what I do, I want/need every horse power my CPU can spit out. I'll stick to XP as long as I can, and if forced to go the Vista route, I am considering (seriously) going Mac.
Reply to this comment
by Lerianis May 20, 2008 2:44 PM PDT
Yeah.... Anyone who posts anything with 'Mac' in it, people should DISREGARD, because they are most likely either a Mac fanboy or have never used Vista ever.
I compared a Mac and a Vista computer SIDE-BY-SIDE at Best Buy recently (was researching a new computer for a friend). Same specs, same hardware basically..... both of them were comparable in speed.
by phimil May 24, 2008 1:46 PM PDT
I don't understand users hate for Vista. it outperforms all previous versions.Vista does a lot of nice things, and I have never suffered any real performance issues. People get so brainwashed from the media they can't see past what the news says. I've enjoyed vista since it came out and will continue to promote it. If your having performance issues, get a better computer. it is by far way better than xp more stable.I find that Vista is by far one of the most efficient versions to date
by Fordry04 May 26, 2008 6:25 PM PDT
how much ram do you have? do you have a dual core processor? cause 2gb and a dual core, and vista will hum along like no other.
by joemajestic May 20, 2008 7:03 AM PDT
Matt, to quote you directly, you said: "Regardless, Microsoft may have to wait until Windows 7 to redeem itself. Will it be too late?"

Too late for what? The survival of Windows? You are joking of course. Microsoft owns the business world. Visit almost any business in the USA (or any other country for that matter) and what OS will they be using?

Maybe it's just that some people just hate to see a company succeed!

Listen up all you Microsoft bashers, Vista will make its way in the world, one PC at a time. It?s just that simple.
Reply to this comment
by giuliocesare May 26, 2008 10:44 PM PDT
I agree with you completely. Vista will eventually become popular. I may recall that when XP was released, it also was unpopular.
by b_baggins May 20, 2008 7:17 AM PDT
MS owns the business world out of inertia, nothing else.
Reply to this comment
by Benf May 20, 2008 10:36 AM PDT
Inertia is all it takes....M$ has won
by The User May 20, 2008 1:30 PM PDT
MS owns the business world because it offers what no one else does - it is just as (or in many cases more) capable as its competitors. However unlike Oracle, IBM or Sun, MS does not require a small army of very expensive consultants to run and support their products. MS business products typically have more features, faster, easier to deploy and use, easier to support and much cheaper to buy than its competition. And that's the reason why MS owns the business world.
by rbslack May 20, 2008 7:39 AM PDT
I have been a professional in the comuter design and implementation field for close to fifteen years and I find that Vista is by far one of the most efficient versions to date. The main reason peaople seem to think it is a dog is because they refuse to investigate their new opating system and set it up according to their usage needs. I have set up Vista for all applications ranging from CAD to media and web development and have foun that with the correct settings it outperforms all previous versions, the only thing you need to remember is that not all features need be installed only install what you need according to your individual usage,
Reply to this comment
by mwooge May 24, 2008 9:58 PM PDT
rbslack says: "The main reason peaople seem to think it is a dog is because they refuse to investigate their new opating system and set it up according to their usage needs."

Unfortunatly, that counts. It is a bad thing to have to adjust an unfamiliar sytem to get to work right. It should work good right out of the box.
by Fordry04 May 26, 2008 6:27 PM PDT
Yes, vista reconfigures its resouce footprint dynamically as it needs to, i am with you, works great for everything unless you are trying to use older versions of hardware or software.
by Kellost May 20, 2008 8:10 AM PDT
I personally Run Windows vista Ultimate and have no problems what so ever.... I have Turned the UAC off and done a bit of other tweaks and the system works just as fast as my XP pro system did. IMO Vista even boots faster. I dont have a top of the line system i am running a AMD 64 3200+ clocked at about 2.0 GHZ 2 Gigs of Ram with a AGP! 7600GS...I know I need an upgrade but I manged to make ultimate to work just fine. I run Photoshop CS 2 and C++ all the time and have not noticed ANY hiccups. only area i see hiccups is when i play Graphic extensive games and have my media player open at the same time. That is just cuz my crappy system though :( I think if you guys took the time to sit down and actually tweak sum setting, rather then wanting them to hand you a perfect operating system, you might find that you enjoy using Vista.
Reply to this comment
by rcaton1 May 24, 2008 8:14 PM PDT
Wow - the nerve of us wanting a perfect OS that we have to shell out $$$ for!!!
by C_G_K May 20, 2008 8:36 AM PDT
I am a computer consultant who works with people using windows O.S.'s every day. Vista is full of bugs and was released before it was ready. It is a bloated performance hog. It is loaded with DRM that will potentially limit users access to their own digital content.

The only users that like it so far in my experience is graphic artists. Everyone else HATES it.
Reply to this comment
by wfoss May 20, 2008 10:25 AM PDT
I'm not a graphic artist. I enjoy it. I take it your in Tech Support so when you get a call its only with issues? Or do you get a lot of calls just wanting to hear your voice?
by Kellost May 20, 2008 12:27 PM PDT
Every Operating system that Mircosoft has Released is full of bugs till they get it patch. My family uses Vista for home and office use and have no problems. In fact they have come to love it. Like I said if you took the time to Tweak it and make it work to your standard your set.
by The User May 20, 2008 12:47 PM PDT
Naturally, users hate everything that requires them to learn. Ordinary users will endlessly complain if they encounter an extra button on their phones, even if it saves them time and effort. IT guys, especially with less than 5 or over 35 years of experience, will complain just to show off their "profound" knowledge. That is imminent.
by Lerianis May 20, 2008 2:47 PM PDT
If you want to blame someone for the DRM..... blame the media companies that MADE Microsoft include the DRM with threats of lawsuits unless they did.
Now, personally..... I have NEVER seen ANY DRM on my machine in my normal usage. None at ALL. Everything I download off the internet plays, I can backup DVD's and images that I have made onto DVD's, etc.
Now, would I have preferred that Microsoft left out the DRM? Yes, but they didn't really have a choice considering that they had big name companies saying "Include DRM or we will sue you out of business!" With their deep pockets.... they could have done it!
by rosebudmccoy May 22, 2008 1:28 PM PDT
I've always worked on MainFrame Systems using Cobol or Assembler. MSN doesn't test their new data and it causes problems to everyone I know that use's MSN.
by rosebudmccoy May 22, 2008 1:29 PM PDT
I've always worked on MainFrame Systems using Cobol or Assembler. MSN doesn't test their new data and it causes problems to everyone I know that use's MSN.
by phimil May 24, 2008 1:46 PM PDT
I don't understand users hate for Vista. it outperforms all previous versions.Vista does a lot of nice things, and I have never suffered any real performance issues. People get so brainwashed from the media they can't see past what the news says. I've enjoyed vista since it came out and will continue to promote it. If your having performance issues, get a better computer. it is by far way better than xp more stable.I find that Vista is by far one of the most efficient versions to date
by Fordry04 May 26, 2008 6:30 PM PDT
what kind of computers are you working with though, old p4's with 512 or 1gb of ram? computers that barely ran xp well? the new base model computers that the manufacturers put out with barely enough resources to run the OS? Come on your a consultant, you should know better!
by SerengetiValley May 20, 2008 9:53 AM PDT
Vista runs well on my 1.66GHz work laptop. No major complaints. This is what is necessary IMO to keep Vista running smoothly:
a) Give it enough RAM. 2 GB is good. RAM is very cheap these days, and 2 GB ought to be standard anyway.
b)Get good drivers. Probably the biggest reason for Vista's poor performance on some machines. Luckily my laptop drivers are stable and seem to work flawlessly.
c)Don't install junk. Goes for XP too.
d) Don't use resource hogs like Norton. Get something like AVG free. Same for the browser- get Opera.Goes for Xp too.
e)Keep the drives defragmented. Vista accesses the drive very often, so keep it happy. I use Diskeeper 2008 and it keeps the drive in great shape.

Vista runs very stable and all my programs work on it perfectly; even old ones. No BSODs, no spinning donuts. YMMV.
Reply to this comment
by Lerianis May 20, 2008 2:55 PM PDT
Yeah, even most NOTEBOOKS I have seen in stores recently: they are coming with anywhere from 3GB's to 4GB's (the latter if they have a 64-bit operating system installed on them).
The hardware manufacturers have realized that Vista is a memory hog (I cannot really blame Microsoft totally for this, this was starting when DOS was around) and are adjusting their systems to compensate.
by kockgunner May 20, 2008 10:09 AM PDT
does it matter what version vista is? basically the only difference is the aero interface and other crap no one cares about. sorry to turn this into a windows vs os x thing but speaking of which, but now you know why mac users defend macs so much. people get brainwashed into thinking that their incompatible, isolated, and slow.
Reply to this comment
by Lerianis May 20, 2008 3:02 PM PDT
There are plenty of differences, I am sorry to say: the UAC prompt, better networking support and speeds (it increased network speeds by 20 times on my parent's computer running Windows XP MCE beforehand), better memory management, the thing that forces programs that would normally run as Admins to run as normal programs, etc.
Secondly, Mac's ARE incompatible and isolated, though not slow. No games work on a Mac system (at least none that a normal person would want to play). Most programs don't have a Mac equivalent. When you buy a Mac, you are locked into using only the hardware that Apple supplies for it. Add to that the price premium on Mac's..... and you see why a Windows PC is a better choice if you are EVER thinking of gaming in any way, shape or form on a computer.
by phimil May 24, 2008 1:56 PM PDT
Personally, I love Vista. It looks good and overall user experience is quite pleasant. it better on looks, but on the functionality as well. I like it better than XP because it simply easier to use and much more pleasant for an eye. I see why it will be slower on older machines (it is perfectly fine on any modern PC and laptop), but that is expected - it is rather foolish to anticipate more graphically advanced products to run on older hardware. why complain about Vista?
by wfoss May 20, 2008 10:28 AM PDT
there are way more features on ultimate than the others.

Perhaps owning the OS and actually doing a bit of research will help.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/windowsvista/editions/ultimate/default.mspx
Reply to this comment
by szekelyrobi May 20, 2008 10:35 AM PDT
I was using Vista on my (relative) new machine for a half year incl. 3 reinstall... the latest boo-boo was loosing the internet connection... installing the latest version of the (btw FREE) Ubuntu (incl. WIFI) on my 6 y.o. laptop was easier than get wifi work on an already installed Vista... My question is why to pay a penny for MS for an os what is simply not ready yet????? They should pay us for testing! LOL.
Reply to this comment
by Fordry04 May 26, 2008 6:33 PM PDT
how relatively new? and what did you do to it? lol, if you had hardware with poor driver support, that isn't microsft's fault.
by jssshashi May 20, 2008 12:09 PM PDT
I was frustruated with the spinning bagel. and making my partitions read only by default.
The UAC can be turned off.
The MCE is great. The Expolrer is great. The Voice Recognition is great, the Pen support is great. I do like vista.,

Just the Spinning bagel. and the favorite apps which dont have a Vista release..
Reply to this comment
by The User May 20, 2008 12:41 PM PDT
Personally, I love Vista. It looks good and overall user experience is quite pleasant. I like it better than Apple's OS not just based on looks, but on the functionality as well. I like it better than XP because it simply easier to use and much more pleasant for an eye. I see why it will be slower on older machines (it is perfectly fine on any modern PC and laptop), but that is expected - it is rather foolish to anticipate more graphically advanced products to run on older hardware. I don't see people complaining about running Crysis on x286, why complain about Vista?
Reply to this comment
by Kalam1ty May 20, 2008 12:48 PM PDT
Dude, shut up. There has never been, and never will be, a new operating system that does not use more resources. If you're going to cheap out on your laptop and get shady, underperforming hardware, that's your business, but don't turn around and complain about how slow it is. You decide how fast your machine will be when you buy it, no one else, and I'm tired of hearing this same old crap. If Vista was the same as XP, there would be no point in having it, so stop complaining that it's different.
Reply to this comment
by MrBoomshadow May 20, 2008 4:12 PM PDT
Of course, when the system actually bears a "Designed for Vista" sticker--not even the much-maligned "Vista Capable" sticker--and still barely runs under Vista, then works perfectly under XP, a very different conclusion is very easy to draw, and it doesn't involve listening to people telling us to "shut up" and "stop complaining that it's different." Different can be good (Xerox PARC was different; Mac OS was different; Windows XP was different) or bad (so was the Edsel).
by giuliocesare September 25, 2008 9:45 PM PDT
I agree. It is idiotic to assume that a version of a certain piece of software will not take up any more resources than the previous version of the same software.
by tiranusdj May 20, 2008 1:12 PM PDT
i guess MS keeps trying to protect it´s "baby" just like a mother would do to it´s child. anyone can see that Vista har inumerous fouls and problems, but MS keeps saying that it should run well on the "recommended" system configuration... well.. the recomended system config is NOT the one found on the software box... to run Vista as it should, you´ll need 4GB of ram (dual channel), dual core 2.4GHz proc, DX10 videocard with 512mb and 160GB of HDD.

the problem is that most PC confgs aren´t like these.

recently my fiancé bought a HP DV6000 notebook (160GB, 2GB ram, amd 2.0GHz) and i tought this config. should be fast enough for her... but it wasn´t! the Nonebook came along with the NORTON antivirus software and and it was painfully slow!

i had to desable some features and to uninstall the norton to get the notebook running on the 100%.

hope Windows Seven will be much better... I almost bought an IMAC...
Reply to this comment
by The User May 20, 2008 1:20 PM PDT
What you state is somewhat misleading. It runs just fine, with full Aero on 3.2 P4, 1GB RAM, 60 Gb HDD and 128 Mb ATI card laptop. It was fine, no Aero though, on 2.0 P4, 512Mb RAM, 40 Gb HDD, 32 Mb Video laptop.
by Law2010 May 21, 2008 5:08 AM PDT
Alright, I can tell you right off what is wrong with your wife's computer. You bought her an HP. Don't worry, I am typing from my HP tx1120us, which is roughly the same as hers with a worse video card. I kid you not, there is nothing wrong with that computer, but definitely something wrong with HP's bloatware that comes with it. Uninstall all of the HP update stuff, Vongo, all of the other trial software, etc. You can find all of it in the uninstall menu. Get rid of anything HP except for the HP wireless assistant, networking assistant, or just about anything to do with your internet connection. Also, do not uninstall your drivers for the DVD player unless you hate quickplay. I kid you not, once you do this, her computer will fly. The issue is not Vista, it is HP setting up a bunch of their crap that all runs as soon as you boot into the OS. Get rid of all that stuff. Do not worry about HP update because windows vista update still finds all the updates for your drivers, and it does a better job than HP update (no joke). There is nothing wrong with that computer, and it is more than optimal for running Vista with full Aero and no slow downs. Go through your control panel and uninistall all the pre-installed HP stuff. I chugged for 15 minutes until I got all that stuff off, and boom, perfect. The whole process of me starting my computer and the whole laptop being booted and running my spreadsheets is 30 seconds, which is a whole lot faster than XP.
by Composer_1777 May 26, 2008 3:42 PM PDT
i got a 2 ghz Centrino duo and 2 gig ram sony vaio and Vista business runs faster than XP did on my old Sony vaio with 2 ghz normal centrino and 1 gig of ram. You're problem is norton and you probably didn;t turn off/disable enough auto-features. Norton makes any omp run slow, its the worst program, not to mention all those pre-installed things u got on the HP.
by chulerico May 20, 2008 1:21 PM PDT
I just don't understand all the haters, running vista ultimate 64b and love it much better than xp, my machine runs just as fast and boots faster, and overall feel is excellent, there is no comparison

if you have a nice system vista is the way to go, but if you have a crappy system, celeron, ect, stick with old OS that is not demanding, like windows 2000 or linux

and we really need new writes here at cnet, currently just wasting people's time with mediocre opinions without anything backing them up.

ms will be here, but hope some of these writes don't,

sam
Reply to this comment
by cardfan1212 May 20, 2008 1:41 PM PDT
There's just a lot of idiots out there that don't know computers. They want it stupid and Macs deliver..
Reply to this comment
by MrBoomshadow May 20, 2008 4:08 PM PDT
There are also a lot of us who do know computers, and would rather use Windows XP because it does what we want it to do when Vista won't.
by Composer_1777 May 26, 2008 3:45 PM PDT
lol well said.
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About The Open Road

Matt Asay brings a decade of in-the-trenches open-source business and legal experience to the Open Road, with an emphasis on emerging open-source business strategies and opportunities. Matt is general manager of the Americas division and vice president of business development at Alfresco, a company that develops open-source software for content management. He is a member of the CNET Blog Network and is not an employee of CNET. Disclosure.

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