August 19, 2008 8:07 AM PDT

Microsoft gets paid twice as Vista users downgrade to XP

by Matt Asay
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In a clear indictment of Microsoft's Windows strategy, new research suggests that up to a third of all new Windows Vista machines get downgraded to XP, either by the hardware vendors like Dell, or by customers.

That is a massive number. Ironically, it's a number that works to the short-term advantage of Microsoft's top and bottom lines, but it still represents a vote of "no confidence" in Microsoft's Windows strategy.

Microsoft's only hope at this point is that customers will forget Vista as rapidly as they did Millennium and ramp up anticipation for Windows 7. Actually, it's real hope is that Windows 7 will be worth waiting for.

No one is buying Apple's machines because of an upgrade from OS X 10.3 to 10.5. They're upgrading from Windows XP or from the iPod or iPhone. They want, in other words, a different computing experience, not merely an improved operating system. No one thinks about operating systems anymore. Or not much.

Until Microsoft finds some compelling reason for people to care about its operating system, or provides differentiated value beyond the operating system, it's going to find that Windows 7 won't solve its ills. Midori, which blends the cloud with the desktop, is a much smarter bet. Windows 7? It feels like more of the same Vista problem.

Matt Asay brings a decade of in-the-trenches open-source business and legal experience to The Open Road, with an emphasis on emerging open-source business strategies and opportunities. Matt is vice president of business development at Alfresco, a company that develops open-source software for content management. He is a member of the CNET Blog Network and is not an employee of CNET. Disclosure. You can follow Matt on Twitter @mjasay.
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by drjoewebb August 19, 2008 8:57 AM PDT
Ain't that amazing? I'm using Kubuntu, and I must say I am having the grandest time without Windows. I'm actually getting work done! My system doesn't crash! Stuff that's connected to the computer actually works! And it's free. When free works this well, why do Vista?
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by freddyoner August 20, 2008 12:00 AM PDT
yeah kubuntu of course it runs great in any old machine. I think this is a great solution for people that don't wanna spend money on new computers and of course if you don't wanna do anything but search the internet or use a word processor. I just think there is so much to computing than that. I want to connect my computer to my TV I wanna it to not only record my shows but show them to me in my living room. I want to, from my living room, connect my mp3 and upload my media to my computer upstair through my media extender. I want to deal with an OS that is more intutive and easy to use. I want it to run in 64 bit just like linux but with a bunch of more app's that were made and build for my version of windows. I don't wanna have to worry every time I download software from the internet if the software was made for my linux distro. I want to not just search for hours without end from forum to forum when linux doesn't work but I want to call customer service and ask questions and talk to a real person. I guess I just want much much more.
by freddyoner August 20, 2008 12:10 AM PDT
Oh by the way Windows hasn't crashed for me since my last computer. I think it ran windows me in it. I don't even think windows crashes any more than OSX or any linux distro. I do remember my friend using kubuntu and this app that kept crashing on him. It was his media player called AMAROK or something like it. It was the main media player that came with the OS and it was even worse than iTunes.
by Vegaman_Dan August 19, 2008 9:29 AM PDT
CNET needs to hire an editor.


Headline: Microsoft gets paid twice as Vista users downgrade to XP


Story content: Nothing about Microsoft getting paid twice at all. No evidence, facts, or any shred of proof.


Results: This isn't jounalism. It's just a lame attempt by the author to generate page views without giving any content. And unfortunately it will work. This sort of content really damages the credibility of real reporters and journalists who work to find stories instead of tossing out random comments with nothing to back them up.

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by The_Decider August 19, 2008 10:51 AM PDT
Again you prove your stupidity.

1. This is an opinion piece not a news article.

2. Outside of businesses that have certain licenses, if you buy a machine with Vista and are smart enough not to want it, have to buy a copy of XP, since OEM copies don't transfer.

Learn to use some reasoning skills. Why is it that MS shills are getting so defensive about the mountains and mountains of evidence that Vista is a mistake of ME proportions?

MS failed, accept it and move on.
by ArtInvent August 19, 2008 9:37 AM PDT
Once again, a nice blog about open source that isn't .

The obvious connection of the problems facing MS with open source is that this continues to be quite an opportunity for Linux and other open source OS's. And yes, Linux is a very different computing experience: one of freedom and openness and choice and flexibity. But our blogger instead gets in a plug for: Apple, which is the opposite of open source. Come on Matt: try and focus here.
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by geekboy550 August 19, 2008 10:34 AM PDT
Matt where have you been living in a cave Vista is running beautiful for me and my customers who know what they are doing . In my experience people who are having problems with Vista were also having problems with XP because they are clueless. Or they are trying to run it on hardware that was barely capable of running XP .They thought it was fast with XP because they had nothing to compare it to . I have found most technology journalists like you usually do not know what they are talking about have you even tried it yourself since SP1 or are you just going along with the Vista bashing because it sells and keeps your paycheck coming .
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by The_Decider August 19, 2008 11:27 AM PDT
You forgot two things in your mindless shilling:

The same machine running Vista "beautifully" will run XP even better. So what do you get for the loss of resources?

Vista is flawed in its architecture. One example is the heap manager. It is not an implementation problem that can be fixed with a patch, it is a "structural" problem that will forever be with Vista. What that means is that taking over a Vista machine is simple, no matter how patched it is.
by techmark101 August 19, 2008 9:30 PM PDT
"who know what they are doing" ... My customers who know what they are doing have no problem launching rockets to the moon or writing their own linux distribution !! ;-) My biggest complaint about MS is the built in obsolescence and the forced operating system "upgrades" . I'm running VMCnetfix , When MS comes out with their own netflix product , whatayawanna bet mine stops working after an "update" that I have to accept or I can no longer do any updates... Thats my prob with MS. (on top of stability and viruses and trojans and redirects and ...)
by geekboy550 August 19, 2008 10:36 AM PDT
Matt where have you been living in a cave Vista is running beautiful for me and my customers who know what they are doing . In my experience people who are having problems with Vista were also having problems with XP because they are clueless. Or they are trying to run it on hardware that was barely capable of running XP .They thought it was fast with XP because they had nothing to compare it to . I have found most technology journalists like you usually do not know what they are talking about have you even tried it yourself since SP1 or are you just going along with the Vista bashing because it sells and keeps your paycheck coming .
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by paulej August 19, 2008 8:10 PM PDT
Why do people constantly give Vista a bad name? I've used every release of DOS and windows since DOS 1.0 or 2.0, except for Windows 98 and ME. I skipped those and moved over the NT. But, honestly, I have had no trouble whatsoever from Vista. It did require upgrades for hardware (device drivers), but vendors did produce those. So, everything works, nothing ever breaks -- certainly not more so than with XP. So, what gives? Are there really problems or are people blowing smoke, passing along rumors, or bashng for the heck of it? I really don't get it.

There are only two annoyances I have with Vista, but at least one can be viewed as "a good thing". The first is the silly prompts that I get every time I want to install something or go to the control panel, etc. I guess it might have been for security, I don't know. But after a while, you just get used to it and click the button to go on... it is (almost) useless in terms of security. So, I'd vote to get rid of it.

The second is that Vista uses a LOT of memory. But, I actually think that's a good thing. We are now seeing machines on store shelves with 5GB of RAM. And the cost? Same as before. Nobody is losing money on memory, of course. Prices naturally fall and capacity increases. Plus, folks are taking a serious look at 64-bit Vista, which is great. It's about time we move forward.

So, for all of those who complain about Vista, what problems have you actually encountered? If they were driver problems, then hasn't the hardware manufacturer addressed that already?
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by freddyoner August 19, 2008 11:46 PM PDT
Most people that complain about vista are trying to run this brand new OS in old machines. They also complain because their Nintendo NES cartridges don't work in the Wii, if you know what I mean. I think people should leave those old clunkers they call PC's and make a decision. Either look in the internet for a Linux distro that would be the only option for the antique machinery they call computers, or embrace the new era and spend a little more than a hundred bucks on a new computer. Why did you all people think. You could buy vista for a hundred bucks and make your old 20 dollar worth of computer and make it run like one that's worth $500? I don't think so. and if it's this the reason you're spreding bad rumors about vista than get used to it. You will not be able to run vista, OSX (even if you could) or any other top of the line OS in it. There is no way around this. You were not be able to run XP in a PC made in the early 90's what would make you all believe this time around it would be any different? I spent about 700 bucks on my machine. That isn't a lot for a machine that runs perfectly with vista. It originally came with XP and upgraded later. It has an intel pentium D and it runs Vista perfectly since the get go. My sound card needed an update but that's about it. People should be glad that you can own a PC's these days for even less than mine and run one of Microsoft best yet 64 bit Windows Vista as opposed to spending over a thousand bucks on an apple computer. I am just glad to have a cheaper option and glad that is not just more efficient but also great looking. Even apple copied many of the features that came with vista on their new OS. what apple calls parental controls, spot light, clear windows (aero style), apple's time machine, and a bunch of stuff they claim to be theirs but is really the other way around. Remember when longhorn had that desktop search in it way before spot light came around. I am just glad to have Vista in my life and I can't wait till I can use my adobe photoshop 64 bit in it that, by the way, will not be available for any other OS for a while.
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by regulator1956 August 20, 2008 8:03 AM PDT
Amazing. People are willing to pay Microsoft twice, instead of paying $0 for Linux (open source).

I wonder how many copies of Windows 2000 Professional were sold after Windows XP was available? Businesses put processes in place and try not to vary for a while.

I worked at a Java development shop until 2004. We didn't go to Windows XP until late 2003 - 2 years after it was released. I'd like to see market penetration numbers after Vista has been out 2 years.

Market Share:
Linux - 0.5%
OS X - 8.0%
Windows - 91%

Open Source Rules !!!!!
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by rlwings December 9, 2008 3:09 PM PST
Well, here we go again. Complaining once again about the best thing ever to hit the computer world....Windows Vista.

True, that the only people who complain about Vista fall into two categories....(1) Those who are running equipment from the 'out of date' era....(Basically cheep people), And (2) ,People who don't have a clue on how to run a successful computing experience and have a chip on their shoulder rooted in childhood.

Win Vista marks a new era in computer excellence....in terms of its interface, usability, functionality, and diverse intelligent intuitive design. Not to mention great pains employed to make it secure. (By the way, anything can be restructured if need be.)

Where else will you go......Microsoft has the best researchers, designers, and programmers in the world! There is no way that anything can really keep up...Microsoft is the only company in the world with the resources to produce the very best..... Everything else falls short as a dim copy. A want to be.

There is a reason that the PC platform has won out!....It works better, and the general population has recognized this fact, and has voted for the best (By their purchases.) Do you really think that an inferior product would have survived this long if it were truly inferior!!!?? It couldn't. The truth always comes out eventually....and Microsoft has 'nailed' the way to support computing for the most amount of people.

The underdogs, such as Mac, and Linux usually get support from the underdogs of society....yes, the abused, neglected, therefore mentally disturbed folks who cant stand to line themselves up with successful people and organizations because it reminds them of their own miserable, failed existence!

Don't be fooled by such ignorant, defensive uttering......Microsoft is, and will continue to produce the world's best, and finest products.
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About The Open Road

Matt Asay brings a decade of in-the-trenches open-source business and legal experience to the Open Road, with an emphasis on emerging open-source business strategies and opportunities. Matt is general manager of the Americas division and vice president of business development at Alfresco, a company that develops open-source software for content management. He is a member of the CNET Blog Network and is not an employee of CNET. Disclosure.

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