• On MovieTome: Megan Fox on TRANSFORMERS 2!
June 14, 2008 6:00 AM PDT

Google-Yahoo deal good news for IM, but...

Instant-messaging power users, rejoice: a barrier between two previously isolated realms of online chat is coming down.

A minor sidelight in the Yahoo-Google search ad deal announced Thursday is that the two companies "agreed to enable interoperability between their respective instant-messaging services, bringing easier and broader communication to users," the companies said. They're not sharing further details at this stage, but it's safe to bet that means people on Yahoo's IM network will be able to chat with those on Google's and vice-versa.

That's a big step in the right direction.

IM is a useful if sometimes intrusive tool, especially in this day and age when the Internet has tightened ties among co-workers, family, and friends. But people and companies don't always use the same networks, meaning that power users either must run multiple IM programs or try to bridge the divide with multiprotocol packages such as Trillian, Adium, Digsby, Kopete, or Pidgin.

IM today is similar to the early days of electronic mail, when users couldn't send messages between incompatible services such as AOL, Prodigy, and CompuServe. Happily, the Internet's SMTP standard for e-mail emerged victorious, and now we only need one e-mail address (leaving aside the issue of personal vs. work identities, but that's a story for another day).

A power user's plight
I'm one of those heavy IM users tormented by today's situation. I have to talk to people on Windows Live Messenger, Yahoo Messenger, AOL Instant Messenger, and Google Talk. It's a pain having separate usernames for each service, but much worse is looking for software that centralizes IM for me.

I recognize I'm not a representative sample of the population at large. I have 797 buddies, many of them the same people represented on multiple services.

AOL said in a statement, in effect, that I am indeed an anomaly. "We have no evidence that interoperating with other consumer IM services is of great interest to AIM users," the company said.

But I've seen the problem worsen in the years I've used IM, and I believe mainstream people will encounter this problem with greater frequency as they change jobs, graduate from schools, meet new friends, and otherwise expand their social horizons.

Walled gardens
There are signs that these days are numbered. As Internet companies race to build rich communities and services on the Web, "walled gardens" have become widely disparaged as a relic.

Yahoo, for example, has pledged to expose formerly closed parts of its business through its Yahoo Open Strategy. And AOL is opening up AIM some, for example, letting Meebo and eBuddy link up.

But it'll take awhile to convince me that the IM walls are truly coming down.

For one thing, most of the progress to date has been through interoperability agreements that permit one service to link with another. That's like CompuServe building a custom gateway to translate and route e-mail from AOL--helpful, but symptomatic of the larger problem. The more IM services there are, the more gateways each service needs to work with the others, and more services are cropping up as companies such as MySpace, Skype, and Facebook add chat abilities.

What we really need is an IM communication standard. The obvious candidate is the XMPP protocol on which Google built its service but that none of the other major players use.

Google, unsurprisingly, shares my view. "The Web is based on open standards and protocols so users can use any browser on any operating system to visit any Web site. We think the open Web model ought to apply to IM," Seth Demsey, senior product manager for Google Talk, said in a statement.

Of course, it's a lot easier for underdogs to endorse standards, and Google has 1 percent share of IM users worldwide, according to ComScore figures in April.

Interoperability isn't easy
To be fair, IM interoperability isn't an easy technical problem to tackle for mammoth services with millions of users and messages. There also are privacy issues when one service is sharing data and buddy lists with another.

More complicated are higher-level features and services that IM companies have added atop basic text chat: status messages, avatars, file transfer, voice and video chat, message forwarding to mobile phones. I think there's still value to unifying basic text chat even if higher-level features remain fragmented.

Then, of course, there are business reasons to keep things separate. Yahoo, AOL, and Microsoft all display ads on their services, and AOL is trying to make its service into a foundation on which programmers will create online applications. Opening up IM connections to other services means, for example, that someone using AIM might not see the ads displayed on the AIM software.

I can't help but wonder, though, if a unified IM landscape might spur faster growth and more extensive use of IM services--factors that mean those people using popular chat software could spend even more time gazing at ads.

Other interoperability deals
There are some other interoperability deals besides the Yahoo-Google one announced Thursday. Most notably, users of Microsoft and Yahoo instant-messenger services can link up and chat if they're using recent versions of the software.

And there could be more progress on this front: "Microsoft looks forward to continuing our interoperability reach to customers worldwide," Brian Hall, Microsoft's general manager of Windows Live, said in a statement.

Users of Apple iChat can link with AIM and Google.

Google's situation is complicated, in part because it has multiple IM options. The company offers Google Talk in two incarnations: client software that can be installed on Windows machines and a gadget that runs in a Web browser. Those versions can work with any XMPP-based chat service. (They're not popular, so you probably haven't heard of them.)

Google also has Gmail chat, which runs alongside the company's Web-based e-mail service. It can work with AIM.

So tell me: Am I an anomaly because I use multiple chat networks? And how do you solve your IM needs? Does a single IM client suffice, or do you use two to cover the bases? Send an e-mail to stephen.shankland@cnet.com or share your opinion in the feedback section below.

Recent posts from News Blog
Supreme Court ignores EchoStar appeal against TiVo suit
EA Mobile, Eidos Interactive sign agreement
Sprint first to offer HTC Touch Pro
Flipping out: RIM BlackBerry Pearl Flip 8220 debuts
Sprint HTC Touch Diamond outed early
Add a Comment (Log in or register) 19 comments
by Able-X June 14, 2008 6:30 AM PDT
You're anything but an anomaly, though I think a friends list of 797 people may be a bit odd ;)

Most people I know rely on Digsby, Adium or Pidgin in addition to skype and now possibly ooVoo. It's too many networks! It's also tough to keep straight which features work on which network on which client on which OS. Quite frustrating really.
Reply to this comment
by Riquez-001 June 14, 2008 7:47 AM PDT
I use iChat (AIM), Skype & MSN Messenger. It's been a long frustration to have to use 3 programs for 1 task, but I dont think consolidating to one username is ever going to happen.

I've used Adium etc in the past, but I've found those bridge apps unstable & restrictive.

(Incidentally, iChat also supports Jabber which can link to any service - so you can set up a jabber account in iChat which logs into your msn account for text only chat)

What needs to happen is for the various chat networks, AIM, MSN, Yahoo, Skype, Google etc, to open up their protocols to allow software makers to support all networks in one application - then, just like email, you choose which program you prefer & set up all your accounts in one place - as Adium etc attempt to do.

Unfortunately, because the chat networks are reluctant to allow this, we are stuck with applications that dont fully support all the options. As such I cant always get video chat or file transfers to work unless i use the networks own app.

This is a long running problem which is frankly a joke considering the possibilities of todays technology.
Reply to this comment
by surfboy90291 June 14, 2008 9:06 AM PDT
I rely on IM at work to connect with most of my business contacts on a daily basis. As I work in an industry that needs constant updates of information, IM makes it fast and affordable. I currently use Trillian to connect with AIM, Yahoo IM and Windows Live Messenger. While Trillian is very basic, it does what it should and does it very well - without advertising. Nevertheless, there are features of the other three IM clients that make them appealing. I just can't and won't use them until they can talk to each other.
Reply to this comment
by JuggerNaut June 14, 2008 9:08 AM PDT
Over 95% of my friends are on AIM and about 20% of them are also on GoogleTalk and Skype. That's about the only 3 IM networks I care about. I don't know anyone who use Yahoo or MSN for IM. I do like the idea of IM networks working seamlessly together without me having to have a IM screen-name for everyone of them. Imagine if the various mobile networks and their branded phones didn't interoperate together, we'd have 3 or 4 phones to carry around just to talk to all of our friends.
Reply to this comment
by Spartan_458 June 14, 2008 9:11 AM PDT
I use Trillian, mainly for AIM use, but I also talk to a few people on Windows Live/ MSN Messenger.
Reply to this comment
by Tony McCune June 14, 2008 9:11 AM PDT
I think the standards are the answer. In the mean time I use Adium and Skype. Adium gives me support for iChat, Gtalk, and MSN. Trillian does the same thing on the Windows side. If someone wants to communicate with me by IM they can adopt an IM that plays nice. In this case market forces are you and I. We can influence the outcome by influencing our "buddies"
Reply to this comment
by JCPayne June 14, 2008 11:03 AM PDT
Block all the spam from Microsoft--IM first though before you downgrade Google's IMer....
Reply to this comment
by Bugeater222 June 14, 2008 1:16 PM PDT
Everyone in my industry (which is not computer savvy) uses MSN Messenger. Also, in Central America where I often travel everyone uses MSN Messenger as well. Many of these people dont even know other IM programs exist.

I understand that AOL dominates the market, but I believe that all of us are caught in our own little window of our own personal worlds.

In the business world and in my world with people over the age of 35, u have to adapt to their IM, so I use Trillian with 80% MSN, 19% AOL and 1% Yahoo.

At least 15-20% of my contacts I have never met in person and are just for business. Bottom line is WE NEED A STANDARD!!!
Reply to this comment
by nls75 June 14, 2008 3:19 PM PDT
I have 5 cell phones on my desk, my friends uses different phone companies so of course I need to have a phone for each of these to stay in contact.... in year 2008? That would be a laugh.. but for IM ... that still is true..
Reply to this comment
by dexter_birdbrain June 14, 2008 3:53 PM PDT
Well, even I use Pidgin to login to Yahoo & Google. Again, I have one or 2 contacts from MSN (Hotmail) added to my Yahoo account since the days Microsoft started getting cozy with Yahoo. I sorely miss the voice chat facilities on Pidgin but having all my friends in the same place more that makes up for it.
Reply to this comment
by ladraper June 14, 2008 8:28 PM PDT
In the interim, while there really aren't standards for interoperability, the next best thing is Meebo. I have combined all my Yahoo, AIM, MSN, google buddies within one meebo account. And for the most part it works just fine. I have the option of disconnecting my personal IM connections which I reserve primarily for one IM service, while I'm at work. Meebo doesn't require any downloads so I don't have to worry about using a work computer that has restrictions, though I do primarily use IM for work and find it's a great tool to get quick responses sometimes. Check it out. http://meebo.com
~from a happy Meebo user~
Reply to this comment
by Cube Over June 15, 2008 1:34 AM PDT
I have used ICQ since 1997, but, frustrated with their lousy compatibility in encodings, file transfers, and general impossibility to start a voice or video chat, I migrated to AIM. There I could add my best buddies from ICQ! MSN - long forlorn, Yahoo! IM - closed along with my e-mail spambox 2 years ago.
I also use Skype, this makes it for just 2 services (AIM, Skype).
I must confess that Yahoo! IM was the best IM ever! Videochat 'just worked' back in 2001, even between MacOS 9 and Windows 95! No hassles whatsoever with national character encoding. It was just plain brilliantly consistent service! PhotoSharing features in PC Client was a bliss!!!
If only I had buddies there.
Reply to this comment
by TheReaperD June 15, 2008 6:01 AM PDT
I use Pidgin (Windows) and Kopete (Linux) due to the fact I have contacts on Yahoo, MSN, AIM, ICQ and a few Jabber clients. Having all of the different systems sucks.

@Cube Over: The truly sad part is that Yahoo IM videochat worked then but is a steaming pile now...
Reply to this comment
by rmanachi June 16, 2008 12:56 PM PDT
"We have no evidence that interoperating with other consumer IM services is of great interest to AIM users," the company said. REALLY that seems like BS to me. As a long time AIM user i would very much appreciate the ability to IM with friends on other IM services, notably Yahoo.
Reply to this comment
by JohnWeisenfeld June 17, 2008 12:06 PM PDT
Microsoft has had interop with Yahoo since July 2006.
http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2006/jul06/07-12IMInteropPR.mspx

The question I had was if Yahoo interop with Google enables Microsoft to Google interop.
Reply to this comment
by Gualban June 19, 2008 3:26 AM PDT
XMPP is a clear winner when it comes to protocols/standards for Internet IM, and is growing steadily in usage, unseen. On the Mobile Instant messaging front, "Wireless Village" (IMPS) offers most promise, since it is wired with mobile in mind and is also open standards. It uses less bandwidth and offers multimedia support in the base protocol. Sadly there are few implementations out there, although software, some of it free, is beginning to show up on the scene
Reply to this comment
by ricearonironi June 30, 2008 4:10 PM PDT
Just about everyone 25 years old and younger in the U.S. uses AIM. I don't know anyone who IM's that doesn't use it. People should just switch to AIM and make things easier.
Reply to this comment
by davecridland July 15, 2008 4:37 AM PDT
It's frustrating to see you suggest that because Google Talk only has 1% of the market share, therefore XMPP as a whole is a dead loss. While it's certainly true that XMPP isn't as big as the other protocols, it's a lot bigger than just Google Talk, and discussing individual IM services isn't how to consider this.

Look at jabber.org, for instance, which adds another 373,693 users to XMPP just through one server. Or look at SAPO in Portgual, a deployment which adds a significant chunk of Portugal's ISP market.

And this still ignores the thousands of other servers - some of which are small, some of which quite large - and the increasing number of services which integrate to XMPP - like the newly launched http://identi.ca/ or the rather older http://jaiku.com/ - as well as big names like Facebook.

This discussion is essentially over - Yahoo is likely to go XMPP, AOL almost certainly will follow, given their previous experimentation, and that will essentially leave MSN out on a limb.

Even just Yahoo is quite likely to tip the balance of the Sametime and Groupwise corporate islands into moving toward XMPP themselves - this would add a rush of XMPP servers in the same way that corporate email systems added a rush of SMTP servers when they federated.
Reply to this comment
by benjaminstraight August 3, 2008 2:24 PM PDT
Pretty cool. Streamlining a major mode of communication for many people.
Reply to this comment
Powered by Jive Software
Resource center from News.com sponsors
You Need The Speed of Norton 2009
Introducing Norton Internet Security™2009

Click Here!
With one-click, one-minute install, under 8MB of memory usage and fewer, shorter scans, it's the fastest security suite anywhere. Norton. Smart Security, Engineered for Speed. Get a FREE trial today!

Click Here!
The Fastest Security Suite Anywhere

Experience the revolutionary Norton Internet Security™ 2009. With Norton™ Insight, a new feature, you get precision security that targets only at risk files for fewer, faster, shorter scans

Win a Trip to Space!*

Enter the Blast Off with Norton Sweepstakes for your shot at a trip to space. You could experience being fast and weightless, just like the new Norton 2009. *No purchase necessary; click for full details.

FREE Trial!

Act now to get your FREE trial of Norton Internet Security 2009. Try it for the protection. Love it for the speed

Norton Safe Web NEW!

A community-based system that rates web site safety

Norton Labs NEW!

Users can download new security technologies and share input directly with developers. Help us shape our future products!

About News Blog

Recent posts on technology, trends, and more.

Add this feed to your online news reader

News Blog topics

Featured blogs

advertisement

Inside CNET News

Scroll Left Scroll Right