Toshiba signs up for Blu-ray
This was originally posted at ZDNet's Between the Lines.
Toshiba said Monday it is planning a lineup of products that support the Blu-ray storage format. Toshiba was one of the leading companies behind HD DVD, a standard that lost to Blu-ray.
In a statement, that it will provide "a wide range of advanced digital products" including DVD players, HDTVs, and laptops that support multiple storage devices. "In light of recent growth in digital devices supporting the Blu-ray format, combined with market demand from consumers and retailers alike, Toshiba has decided to join the BDA (Blu-ray Disc Association).
The company said it will roll out Blu-ray products "in the course of this year."
Sony was one of the founders of Blu-ray and supported the technology via its high-definition video products and PlayStation 3. Toshiba ceded the format war to Blu-ray in February 2008. In July, it was reported that Toshiba would roll out Blu-ray products.
Larry Dignan is editor in chief of ZDNet and editorial director of CNET's TechRepublic. He has covered the technology and financial-services industries since 1995. 
The funny thing was, Microsoft convinced Toshiba to support it with the HD-DVD, then left Toshiba out to dry (seriously, the HD-DVD xbox add-on was a half-hearted effort at best). If I were to feel anything about a vendor, I'd feel more sad for Toshiba than Microsoft.
Of course, they have a history of doing that to partners... just look up the PlaysForSure group, or ask IBM.
To address the IBM-Microsoft partnership, are you talking about the ill-fated OS/2? IBM is equally at fault for the failure of OS/2. Microsoft originally wanted to only create a 32-bit OS/2 that required a 386 processor. IBM balked at this and insisted that Microsoft create a 16-bit OS/2 that ran on the 286 processor. Microsoft delivered OS/2 to IBM, and then washed their hands of it to create their own Windows NT. IBM had to create their own 32-bit OS/2, but the product was already viewed as obsolete because they came out with the 16-bit version that they should have never developed.
IBM shot themselves in the foot over that one. I do not blame Microsoft for bailing out on OS/2 and IBM.
http://itvibe.com/news/3612/
Microsoft and Toshiba were indeed partnered to develop HD-DVD. They also pulled in Broadcom later on in a lesser role (http://www.socaltech.com/mobilestory.php?storyid=0006951)
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"Yeah, well that overpriced BluRay player in the PS3 is what is dooming the PS3."
Perhaps, but it won Sony the format war, which is what really mattered to Sony.
"...are you talking about the ill-fated OS/2?"
Your revisionist history aside, I wasn't pointing out specifics, but pointing out the pattern: Partner with Microsoft, and you will likely get burned at the first opportunity.
Either way, your feeble attempts to try to turn every unrelated topic into an lame excuse to bash against Microsoft is just getting tired and unoriginal. You've become an irrelevent joke.
I posted evidence to back up my claims - where is yours? All you have posted thus far is bile and anger - oh, and bald assertion. You're going to have to do better than simply hurling blind hate to make your case.
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@Spartan 458:
"The PS3 didn't win Sony the format war. No one supported HD DVD, which is why it died."
So tell me this: How exactly do you think Sony managed to convince its movie studio competitors (e.g. Paramount) to do exclusive BD (vs. HD-DVD) releases? The answer involves a known market. All those PS3's contributed to a provable market of existing users to consume the product, and therefore (in teh studios' eyes) a viable market. HD-DVD did not have this, since it relied on the far, far smaller number of sold consumer players and the odd handful of xbox users who sprung for the HD-DVD add-on.
The truth is, Microsoft had very little to do with what later became HD-DVD. The originators of HD-DVD were Toshiba and NEC, *not* Toshiba and Microsoft. Toshiba in particular was concerned about the cost of manufacturing Blu-ray players and discs.
So Toshiba developed its own system called Advanced Optical Disc, and along with NEC proposed it to the DVD Forum in the Fall of 2002.
For years, Microsoft did NOT back either Blu-ray nor HD-DVD, since Windows will support *both* formats, and in hopes of a unified standard. However in May 2005, during the PS3 launch Sony confirmed that the PS3 will use Blu-ray. This put a lot of pressure on the (then-upcoming) XBOX 360 to have some kind of HD solution.
Under this context Microsoft decided to finally (and reluctantly) support HD-DVD in late 2005, fully 3-years *AFTER* the Blu-Ray and HD-DVD camps had already split, and a few months *AFTER* both camps announced that they could not agree on a unified standard.
By this time the XBOX 360 was already in the production line and Microsoft had to come up with a viable HD option for it. Had Microsoft known that the PS3 would be delayed for a full year after the 360, they might not have joined the HD-DVD group at all.
So for Random_Walk / Penguinisto to blame Microsoft for "convincing Toshiba" to support HD-DVD is just sad. At this point I don't know why anyone would put any credibility into anything this guy says.
Sony learned well from the Betamax vs. VHS wars, and lost Betamax to similar tactics back in the day. VHS got traction because the proponents managed to persuade studios (especially porn studios) to start releasing VHS-only movies. The fact that it took longer only reflects the slower-moving nature of the industry back in the 1980s, coupled with legacy support issues that had built up by the time the war was really on.
Me, I have no preference... I'll happily continue to use plain old DVD for now.
The issue of control over the DRM (IIRC) had a lot to do with why the HD-DVD/BD break-off started in the first place. To wit: Microsoft was apparently unable to get the BD group to bend to it's demands concerning DRM, so it decided to go its own way and talked Toshiba along for the ride (though Toshiba likely had its own reasons as well).
And it's funny how you cite an unproven payment to Warner from Sony, when it's a known fact that Paramount took money to drop Blu-ray and go HD DVD exclusive. Face it, Toshiba was doomed to fail from the beginning with an inferior format, less studio support, way less CE manufacturer support, a much smaller target market, and a foolish sell at a loss strategy.
If Blu-ray hardware was/is expensive because of draconian DRM, then why were 1080p HD DVD players the same MSRP as a lot of Blu-ray players? I think Blu-ray hardware was expensive and is still more expensive than most DVD hardware because new technology is almost always expensive (or at least more expensive), largely due to higher production costs (including research and development costs).
- by Captain-Atari August 12, 2009 8:06 AM PDT
- loki2240 wrote: And it's funny how you cite an unproven payment to Warner from Sony, when it's a known fact that Paramount took money to drop Blu-ray and go HD DVD exclusive. Face it, Toshiba was doomed to fail from the beginning with an inferior format, less studio support, way less CE manufacturer support, a much smaller target market, and a foolish sell at a loss strategy.
- Like this Reply to this comment
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(34 Comments)Hey loki..
It was a payoff and it's not unproven.
http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/13009.cfm
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08012/848675-96.stm
http://gizmodo.com/344680/
Do you really think Warner would pick the more expensive format to create movies for based on the sales at that time? HD-DVD had picked up considerable steam and had more dedicated players which is more important than movies sales in the short term. Sony had to buy them off because if Bluray failed that would have been the nail in the coffin for the struggling PS3. Which by the way is still selling at a loss. Sony is still losing on both Bluray and the PS3. As far as technology goes HD-DVD was far more solid and cheaper to produce and most important it's standards were complete. Thereare still incompatible BD players out there. Most important remember that HDDVD was 1st and Sony came in with the unfinished Blu-ray tech and used FUD to create an alternate standard. They want patent money plain and simple and they have very nearly ruined the company in pursuit of it. In the end it might not be worth it.
Also the consumers didn't make that decision. Almost a year after the HDDVD "DYING" THERE WERE STILL MORE DEDICATED HD-DVD players than dedicated BLU-Ray. The BDA inflates the numbers using the PS3 but nobody really knew how many of those units were actually used for movies at the time. Like I said before this format war was nothing of the sort. In the future media standards should be set by impartial parties with some government regulation thrown in. Can you imagine if the HDTV standard was handled like the HD DVD/Blu-Ray mess. We would be on Analog TV for another 20yrs.