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Developers get taste of Intel-based Macs
June 10, 2005
Apple supplied the Intel-fitted PowerMac to members of its Apple Developer Connection, a group for software programmers. The PowerMac includes a microcontroller known as the Trusted Platform Module--TPM for short--that contains a digital signature necessary in order to install the Mac OSX operating system onto the box.
An ADC member, who asked not to be identified, confirmed the microcontroller's existence to CNET News.com.
Representatives of Apple and Intel declined to comment on the inclusion of the TPM chip in the PowerMac.
The ADC source reported being able to install other operating systems like Windows and Linux onto the test box. But it was impossible, the source said, to install software from the DVD containing the Intel-configured Mac OS onto similar x86-based PCs that lacked a TPM.
Some Mac fans disagree with Apple's desire to prevent the loading of its Intel-based OS on non-Mac boxes. Another issue for some is that the TPM could compromise the privacy of users because of the identifying number built into the chip. The technology could also restrict the use of some digital media by enforcing digital rights management technologies.
Reactions on the OSx86 Forum, Slashdot and other fan sites ran the gamut from annoyance to just plain resentment against Apple for joining Microsoft, Advanced Micro Devices, Hewlett-Packard and Lenovo in support of the technology.
"The 'bru ha ha' is that it won't just be the ADC people that have to deal with TPM. Everyone that buys a new Mac will. That's what the big deal is. No one wants to deal with the TPM," said an OSx86 Forum moderator known as Mashugly.
One fan threatened to remove his Apple tattoo should the company include the security chip in its new Macintosh products, which are expected to be on sale by next summer.
Those overly concerned with the issue may have short memories. During the announcement back in June, Apple said its machines would not support other operating systems outside of the Mac OSX, but the company also said it would not be able to prevent underlying software from Microsoft or a Linux distribution from being installed.
Apple is currently transitioning its computers to Intel processors from the PowerPC chips made by IBM. In addition to hardware, Apple is supplying software and other resources as part of its Developer Transition Kit.
A representative with Apple did say that the computers shipped to developers are the same as the one Apple CEO Steve Jobs used during a demo onstage at the company's developer conference in June.
Participating developers received a PowerMac that runs on an Intel D915GUX motherboard powered by a Pentium 4 660 Prescott that reaches top speeds of 3.60GHz, the ADC source said.
The existence of the TPM chip, manufactured by Infineon Technologies, is no guarantee that Apple will be using it in the final Macintosh products shipping next year. But industry analyst Pete Glaskowsky says it is highly likely, considering that Apple has the controller installed now.
"Apple does not want just anybody that has the right Intel motherboard to install the beta version of its software."
Glaskowsky also surmised that Apple developers will come across more surprises as they familiarize themselves with the new Mac architecture.
The ADC source said one welcome surprise was that the combination of Intel chips and the Mac OSX seems to have led to the ability to perform tasks and play games incredibly fast.
See more CNET content tagged:
ADC Telecommunications Inc.,
security chip,
Apple Power Mac,
Apple Computer,
Infineon Technologies AG
OS onto non-Apple hardware? Seriously. Like they want to deal
with tech support calls from some chip-monkey who built their
own POS box with the cheapest crap they could find. They want
to take advantage of the advances Intel is promising, not lower
the bar on the Mac platform to include just anything...
Their consumer models are plenty affordable if you're nickle and
diming. Plus they're well made and mostly problem free.
There's a reason Apple's customer service and computers get
top marks from Consumer Reports and the like.
Apple's part rather than a quality control issue. Something PC mfg's
are not familiar with, quality control.
It is so simply just that, why the commotion?
announced. It would be a foolish business decision to allow every
Intel-box-maker to run OS X. And if Apple wanted to allow that,
they would have released the Intel port years ago.
It's just common sense.
Instead of griping, people should be happy the Intel Macs will
natively boot to Linux or Windows if needed. That's a first!
PC I don't think anywone really cares about that, its a chip that can
be used for so many things, its an ID chip, means that it just does
not stop when the OS checks to make sure the computer is an
apple, its more than than, and can be missused but then most
people may not care, after all, what is freedom, you can't miss it if
your whole life you have not really had it.
OS onto non-Apple hardware? Seriously. Like they want to deal
with tech support calls from some chip-monkey who built their
own POS box with the cheapest crap they could find. They want
to take advantage of the advances Intel is promising, not lower
the bar on the Mac platform to include just anything...
Their consumer models are plenty affordable if you're nickle and
diming. Plus they're well made and mostly problem free.
There's a reason Apple's customer service and computers get
top marks from Consumer Reports and the like.
Apple's part rather than a quality control issue. Something PC mfg's
are not familiar with, quality control.
It is so simply just that, why the commotion?
announced. It would be a foolish business decision to allow every
Intel-box-maker to run OS X. And if Apple wanted to allow that,
they would have released the Intel port years ago.
It's just common sense.
Instead of griping, people should be happy the Intel Macs will
natively boot to Linux or Windows if needed. That's a first!
PC I don't think anywone really cares about that, its a chip that can
be used for so many things, its an ID chip, means that it just does
not stop when the OS checks to make sure the computer is an
apple, its more than than, and can be missused but then most
people may not care, after all, what is freedom, you can't miss it if
your whole life you have not really had it.
even support windows.. Considering that Apple and Intel
engineering is working together on this venture. I would think that
the final result will be something far superior to the piles of
commodity crapola that the various PC resellers are selling. Mac
OSX is so reliable because software and hardware are designed by
the same company.. Its the same with Sun and HP (UNIX) hardware
as well.
"After Jobs' presentation, Apple Senior Vice President Phil Schiller
addressed the issue of running Windows on Macs, saying there
are no plans to sell or support Windows on an Intel-based Mac.
"That doesn't preclude someone from running it on a Mac. They
probably will," he said. "We won't do anything to preclude that."
However, Schiller said the company does not plan to let people
run Mac OS X on other computer makers' hardware. "We will not
allow running Mac OS X on anything other than an Apple Mac,"
he said."
not want to have a strong technical background in computers.
Geeks are quite happy to support themselves whch is fine, but
the average user just wants to use their computer. So this leaves
them with a choice, purchase an Apple or other branded
machine, which they can take back if it doesn't work, or learn
how computers work, how to support windows or linux. Apple is
strong in this way, why not support your own operating system,
which is better than the competition, more user friendly and
largely far more stable. Who else provides this control over end
user hardware? My predictin for the future with OS 11 or XI, it
will probably run natively Unix/Linux apps seamlessly, even PS3
is tipped to run Tiger, so when your OS goes wrong, you can talk
to Apple, but take adantage of the non-proprietary open source
world, and move away from Micrsoft, who truly isn't really
anybody's friend (malware, virus, adware, genuine advantage
etc. etc)
Brand loyalty and iPod success, very smart, system ease of use is
what people want, Apple excel at delivering this.
even support windows.. Considering that Apple and Intel
engineering is working together on this venture. I would think that
the final result will be something far superior to the piles of
commodity crapola that the various PC resellers are selling. Mac
OSX is so reliable because software and hardware are designed by
the same company.. Its the same with Sun and HP (UNIX) hardware
as well.
"After Jobs' presentation, Apple Senior Vice President Phil Schiller
addressed the issue of running Windows on Macs, saying there
are no plans to sell or support Windows on an Intel-based Mac.
"That doesn't preclude someone from running it on a Mac. They
probably will," he said. "We won't do anything to preclude that."
However, Schiller said the company does not plan to let people
run Mac OS X on other computer makers' hardware. "We will not
allow running Mac OS X on anything other than an Apple Mac,"
he said."
not want to have a strong technical background in computers.
Geeks are quite happy to support themselves whch is fine, but
the average user just wants to use their computer. So this leaves
them with a choice, purchase an Apple or other branded
machine, which they can take back if it doesn't work, or learn
how computers work, how to support windows or linux. Apple is
strong in this way, why not support your own operating system,
which is better than the competition, more user friendly and
largely far more stable. Who else provides this control over end
user hardware? My predictin for the future with OS 11 or XI, it
will probably run natively Unix/Linux apps seamlessly, even PS3
is tipped to run Tiger, so when your OS goes wrong, you can talk
to Apple, but take adantage of the non-proprietary open source
world, and move away from Micrsoft, who truly isn't really
anybody's friend (malware, virus, adware, genuine advantage
etc. etc)
Brand loyalty and iPod success, very smart, system ease of use is
what people want, Apple excel at delivering this.
http://www.inaniloquent.com/PermaLink.aspx?guid=dbad4003-5b93-430c-87e1-313f766c04c3
mean here. Maybe then it will get read.
OS from being installed on standard PCs, along with the fact that
Windows and Linux are being successfully loaded on Apple
computers affirms my previous statements.
>> Not hardly. The TMP chip is designed to let an X86 install OS
X. That TMP chip has nothing to do with any PC
Steve Jobs is moving his company into the mainstream PC
market. Those who said that technical hurdles would make it
impossible to run Windows on Macintosh hardware are now
wiping egg from their faces
>> No egg at all. There never has been a fundamental barrier to
running Wndows on an Mac - look at Virtual PC as an example
of how to do it with an x86 emulator. In the MscTel, the x86
processor is already there, no emulation required. All that really
is required is a change in Windows code to possibly accept a
virtual BIOS and other ancient artifacts of the PC platform.
Please, research your material better next time.
from running OS X on the average Dell, they wouldn't do
anything to prevent people from installing Windows. Linux
already runs on the Mac.
Quote from cnet article:
"After Jobs' presentation, Apple Senior Vice President Phil Schiller
addressed the issue of running Windows on Macs, saying there
are no plans to sell or support Windows on an Intel-based Mac.
"That doesn't preclude someone from running it on a Mac. They
probably will," he said. "We won't do anything to preclude that."
However, Schiller said the company does not plan to let people
run Mac OS X on other computer makers' hardware. "We will not
allow running Mac OS X on anything other than an Apple Mac,"
he said."
http://news.com.com/Apple+throws+the+switch,+aligns+with
+Intel+-+page+2/2100-7341_3-5733756-2.html
I know not if your post counts as Spam, but I do know that I for one will not venture a visit to your blog.
http://www.inaniloquent.com/PermaLink.aspx?guid=dbad4003-5b93-430c-87e1-313f766c04c3
mean here. Maybe then it will get read.
OS from being installed on standard PCs, along with the fact that
Windows and Linux are being successfully loaded on Apple
computers affirms my previous statements.
>> Not hardly. The TMP chip is designed to let an X86 install OS
X. That TMP chip has nothing to do with any PC
Steve Jobs is moving his company into the mainstream PC
market. Those who said that technical hurdles would make it
impossible to run Windows on Macintosh hardware are now
wiping egg from their faces
>> No egg at all. There never has been a fundamental barrier to
running Wndows on an Mac - look at Virtual PC as an example
of how to do it with an x86 emulator. In the MscTel, the x86
processor is already there, no emulation required. All that really
is required is a change in Windows code to possibly accept a
virtual BIOS and other ancient artifacts of the PC platform.
Please, research your material better next time.
from running OS X on the average Dell, they wouldn't do
anything to prevent people from installing Windows. Linux
already runs on the Mac.
Quote from cnet article:
"After Jobs' presentation, Apple Senior Vice President Phil Schiller
addressed the issue of running Windows on Macs, saying there
are no plans to sell or support Windows on an Intel-based Mac.
"That doesn't preclude someone from running it on a Mac. They
probably will," he said. "We won't do anything to preclude that."
However, Schiller said the company does not plan to let people
run Mac OS X on other computer makers' hardware. "We will not
allow running Mac OS X on anything other than an Apple Mac,"
he said."
http://news.com.com/Apple+throws+the+switch,+aligns+with
+Intel+-+page+2/2100-7341_3-5733756-2.html
I know not if your post counts as Spam, but I do know that I for one will not venture a visit to your blog.
X. ANd OS X can't be tweaked to run on a PC without destroying
most of the OS X functions. Sorry PC owners, but it ain't going to
happen....
I do not mean to imply I disagree with TPM, but how is the architecture different than that of your run of the mill PC?
X. ANd OS X can't be tweaked to run on a PC without destroying
most of the OS X functions. Sorry PC owners, but it ain't going to
happen....
I do not mean to imply I disagree with TPM, but how is the architecture different than that of your run of the mill PC?
OS run on non-Apple equipment.
So, people are upset they can't install a *pirated* copy of the OS X
for Intel beta on a generic box. I feel for them . . .
OS run on non-Apple equipment.
So, people are upset they can't install a *pirated* copy of the OS X
for Intel beta on a generic box. I feel for them . . .
in the software being compatible or as in the hardware?
in the software being compatible or as in the hardware?
Thus, MacIntel (Mac before Intel business philosophy) is more likely.
An IntelMac (Intel before Mac business philosophy) model should suggest that Apple quits the hardware business and focus on software... like Microsoft...
Think about it.
Thus, MacIntel (Mac before Intel business philosophy) is more likely.
An IntelMac (Intel before Mac business philosophy) model should suggest that Apple quits the hardware business and focus on software... like Microsoft...
Think about it.
League Colleges to form Microsith.
FACT: Apple recent Quartly Report way surpassed expectations
in the COMPUTER Sales & their market share is 5% & counting.
FACT: Not all PC's sold with Microsith monopoly OS REMAIN
loaded with that XP teletubbie crap...dump that & load Linux
instead is a growing trend...LINUX NOT counted in the PC market
share of computers preinstalled with MS-OS-POS.
Q: *** are you doing on this page anyway...?
League Colleges to form Microsith.
FACT: Apple recent Quartly Report way surpassed expectations
in the COMPUTER Sales & their market share is 5% & counting.
FACT: Not all PC's sold with Microsith monopoly OS REMAIN
loaded with that XP teletubbie crap...dump that & load Linux
instead is a growing trend...LINUX NOT counted in the PC market
share of computers preinstalled with MS-OS-POS.
Q: *** are you doing on this page anyway...?
This is not to be confused with the possibillity to run Windows on a mac. There's an opportunity there: it will make the switch for many windows users easier when they can switch back to windows on their knew apple hardware or even run them both.
- Oh, come on!
-
by huddie klein
August 5, 2005 2:16 AM PDT
- I thought everybody knew Jobs would stop you from running OSX on a pc. You could argue his choice of Intel over AMD (imho), but he sure is right about this. Apple is about the total package software AND hardware.
-
Reply to this comment
-
Showing 1 of 3 pages (172 Comments)This is not to be confused with the possibillity to run Windows on a mac. There's an opportunity there: it will make the switch for many windows users easier when they can switch back to windows on their knew apple hardware or even run them both.