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Time to delay Vista again?

By CNET News.com Staff
August 2, 2006 11:25 AM PST

A lot is riding on the release of Windows Vista. It's been nearly five years since Windows XP debuted, and the new version still isn't soup yet. Microsoft has already scaled back its plans for the operating system significantly, following several hold-ups. Even with the big cuts, the company still missed this year's holiday season.

Under the latest plan, big businesses should have Vista by November, and the consumer delivery of Vista is set for January. But that's dependent on the operating system sticking to a tight schedule, with a near-final version needing to be ready this quarter.

There is still plenty of open speculation about whether it is really ready to take that step. Even Microsoft is hedging. Last month, Chairman Bill Gates revived doubts about the timing of the release, reportedly saying there was a 20 percent chance of another Vista delay.

Some prominent bloggers are calling on the company to reschedule the release and to send out a Beta 3 version instead. They say that Beta 2, out right now, suggests that the code isn't anywhere ready yet. While another postponement would derail partner plans, the bloggers argue that that's a lesser evil than annoying millions of Windows users.

To find out what people on the street make of it, we asked our Vista Views panel, made up of ordinary readers, this question: Do you agree that delaying Vista again and putting out a third beta is the way to go for Microsoft?


Barb Bowman

Barb Bowman

I'd have to mostly agree, based on the builds I've seen, that Vista is a much longer distance from RC1 (release candidate 1) than it should be. Unless a lot of bugs are squashed and functionality perfected in the next few weeks, I don't see January being a realistic target.

Whether this means a third official beta or more interim builds before the official RC1 release does not matter, as long as the work is done before designating a build RC1.

Barb Bowman is a product development manager for Comcast high-speed Internet who also writes about technology for the Microsoft Windows XP Expert Zone and the Microsoft Vista community.


Mark Casazza

I wasn't planning to be an early adopter, so I don't have my heart set on a January release. But from what I've read, Vista isn't going to provide any "must have" functionality for business users, which means that most of the early adopters are going to be consumers. And if Microsoft delivers a buggy product to the consumers, they'll spend the next several years explaining why they did so.

Since Microsoft isn't going to make the holiday season anyway, I think they'd be a lot better off if they took the extra time and delivered a 100 percent polished product.

Mark Casazza is the director of academic information for the City University of New York.



David Price

David Price

Another round of beta testing is always needed, but seldom done. MS should do the right thing and not release the new OS until it has had serious stress testing. There will still be tons of bugs and security holes for discovery after the public release (the REAL beta test).
David Price is a senior accident analyst at one of the U.S.'s top research and development national laboratories and an award-winning nature photographer.



Wallace Wang

Wallace Wang

We've been waiting over five years already for the successor to Windows XP, so we might as well wait a few more months for Microsoft to ship a secure, reliable operating system. The problem isn't trying to meet the January 2007 release date. The problem is that after such a long delay, Microsoft must absolutely make sure Vista works. There's nothing worse than taking five years, only to release a buggy operating system that just offers marginal improvements over Windows XP.

Rather than try to yank out more features to insure Vista ships on time, Microsoft should work on optimizing Vista. Every new release of Mac OS X from version 10.1 to 10.2 to 10.3 to 10.4 actually added new features while making my ancient G3 iBook faster at the same time. With Mac OS X, it's a no-brainer to upgrade the operating system since you speed up an old computer while getting new features at the same time.

With Windows, the opposite is true. Each succeeding version of Windows needs more hardware and still runs sluggishly. Don't even think about running Vista on a machine originally designed for Windows 98 or even one designed for Windows XP. Ultimately, no matter how long Microsoft takes to ship Vista, the fact that it won't run on existing machines already means Vista is a failure.

Wallace Wang is a freelance computer journalist and author whose books include "Microsoft Office for Dummies" and "Steal This Computer Book."



Josh Phillips

Josh Phillips

I agree. The current builds are not leaving me very confident that Microsoft will meet its currently planned dates. I think they should just annouce the delay as early as possible and factor in some fudge room. To me, putting out a build that isn't at least as reliable as Windows XP is unacceptable, no matter how much more secure it is supposed to be.

Josh Phillips is an IT professional based in California.



Brian Lambert

Brian Lambert

Microsoft should not release an operating system that is still rough around the edges. Vista has been delayed so much and is well overdue, but waiting a little longer to perfect it and get out most the bugs would be appreciated.

This should be Microsoft's magnum opus. There's a lot of competition surfacing in the operating system market with Ubuntu and OS X gaining some popularity. Vista should meet or exceed all the great qualities of these systems. If that means they need to put out a third beta to work out the kinks and make Vista sparkle, then so be it.

I don't want to get Vista when it comes out and have to apply a hundred patches just to fix problems that should have been resolved in development. Microsoft should work swiftly to meet their goals, but if the product needs work, they should realize they may have to sacrifice timeliness for quality.

Brian Lambert is a law student at Southern Illinois University.



Jason Klomps

Jason Klomps

Unfortunately, I think they may be right. Based on the number of still remaining bugs and user issues, and when RC 1 is scheduled to be released later on this quarter, it is hard to say that Vista will be ready.

Honestly, I believe there should be a beta 3 prior to RC1. I feel that a month or two delay would be in the best interests of Microsoft and the public, but nothing more then that.

Jason Klomps of Tucson, Ariz., works in IT support for a call center.



Chris Hacking

Chris Hacking

In the end, people aren't going to care too much about how long Vista takes to ship. Sure, it will live on in certain memories, and immediately after any announcement like this, there will be uproar?but it won't last too long.

What will last is the stigma of a broken OS. Almost nobody uses WinME today, despite the fact that it was supposed to be a better single-user, home system choice than Win2K. In fact, those who didn't want to upgrade to 2K stuck with 98, now over eight years old, if XP was out of their computer's capabilities.

That is the kind of stigma that Vista absolutely, unquestionably cannot afford. Release a good OS, something that can stand up to OSX in appearance, Linux in security, and beat XP in usability and compatibility, and it will be considered a golden-age product, much the way that 98 itself was. What average user cares how long it took, or how many codenames/betas/RCs?

If the current builds aren't up to stuff, give developers and testers a bit more time and make sure they do it right, then dazzle us all. Release dates are NOT more important than quality.

Chris Hacking is a computer engineering student at the University of Washington, Seattle who has worked in Web development and freelance software development.



John Kneeland

John Kneeland

Since they're already going to miss the crucial holiday season, they may as well delay it again. After all, when you've delayed a product for years and years, what's another few months?

John Kneeland is an undergraduate at the University of Pennsylvania, where he is majoring in international relations and East Asian studies.

The Vista Views panel is being brought together by CNET News.com to discover what people on the street think about Microsoft's new operating system.

We're looking for a range of perspectives--from beta testers to business buyers to home PC owners.

Interested in joining the panel pool? Here's how it works:

Whenever key Vista news breaks, we'll e-mail a question to contributors. Sometimes, we'll ask a yes/no question and use the answers for a simple poll. Other times, we'll look for more in-depth feedback on Vista events. It doesn't matter whether you send us two pages or two sentences--we value your comments. And if you don't have an opinion on a particular story, or you don't have time to respond, that's fine too.

The feedback will often reach our readers. Our writers may quote panel remarks in stories. Or we may pull together comments--your two cents--in an article of their own. Occasionally, we'll ask contributors to take part in a weekly podcast to discuss their views with News.com editors and industry experts.

We want to know what our readers think, as Microsoft gets ready for one of its most important launches in years. If you haven't signed up yet, send an e-mail to us at vista-views@cnet.com.


More Feedback
Story: Symantec sees an Achilles' heel in Vista

Reader comment from Brian Clarke:

"Symantec needs to find a better business model than fear-mongering and profiting off of insecure operating systems from Microsoft."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Gates: 20 percent chance of Vista delay

Reader comment from Robert McLaws:

"Everyone has complained for years that Microsoft doesn?t listen to its customers. So why now is everyone complaining when they finally DO start listening?"

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.


Story: Gates to bow out at Microsoft

Reader comment from John Kneeland:

"Ideally, it would mean that Microsoft will focus less on adding new junk and instead focus on making the existing junk work well."

Read more Vista panel comments on this topic here.

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New features are designed to appeal to nonbusiness users. February 22, 2006


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Blog
The latest Windows blog postings on News.com.
Credits

Design: Gautama Swamy
Production: Kristina Wood


Add a Comment (Log in or register) Showing 1 of 2 pages (55 Comments)
VistaVoice Bombs @ Redmond
by Llib Setag August 2, 2006 12:26 PM PDT
Windows Vista Voice Recognition software demonstration in Redmond at Microsoft more like a "voice - wreck"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Y_Jp6PxsSQ&%20eurl=
Reply to this comment
Its all about SECURITY FLAWS
by n3td3v August 2, 2006 12:50 PM PDT
Security flaws keep getting released (For XP) that affect the core code in Vista, they don't tell the public that, they just delay so they can re-code sections of Vista, so its as secure as possible before first shipment to the best of their knowledge. The problem is, after they've re-written Vista, another flaw (For XP) is released that affects Vista core code, so the delays continue.
Reply to this comment
Vista needs patience
by robert1275 August 2, 2006 1:01 PM PDT
Vista looks promising in Beta 2 but I would much rather have Microsoft change the timetable from January 2007 to 'sometime in the 1st quarter' just to give everyone a little leeway to make sure everything is stable. There is also the possibility to have a RC2 as well as RC1 if needed
Reply to this comment
Another beta won't help
by Peter Bonte August 2, 2006 1:35 PM PDT
Users will find so much bugs and software that won't work that MS
would have to delay onto 2008. Microsoft can't afford such a big
delay so jan 2007 it will be with loads of updates afterwards.

If Vista is a bugfest then i really hope Apple will bring osX to the
other side and go for the kill, XP and osX on one machine is a much
better solution then Vista will ever be. Be it a Dell or a Mac.
Reply to this comment
A Delay May Be Virtuous
by palavering August 2, 2006 2:08 PM PDT
In my view, it is imperative that Microsoft releases a secure and nearly(major)bug-free Vista. If the new Vista OS is released prematurely, with faulty drivers (or unavailable drivers), crash-prone OS applications, or it doesn't deliver on proper function and form the Redman-based company will suffer Media and enterprise retribution of all sorts, as well as lose whatever credibility it has managed to sustain in the market. A failure to make decisions based on long-term consequences will be expensive for Microsoft, in every sense imaginable.
Reply to this comment
Why not just postpone for Christmas 07?
by Mothra August 2, 2006 3:26 PM PDT
Why not just postpone for Christmas 07?

I think such a move would please PC companies allowing them to capitalize on the holiday season.
Intel just released the Core 2 and AMD will undoubtedly release a competitor, waiting to next Xmas will be pleny of time for PC companies to adopt either of these newer processors and build machines better suited to handle Vista.

That should also be plenty of time to finish the OS, i think everyone agrees that it needs more work. And maybe even let Microsoft put some things back in that they took out to speed it along. More features would give consumers more of an incentive to upgrade.

Personally, i need a bit more time and money to upgrade my own PC.
Reply to this comment
100 percent polished product?
by stagetek August 2, 2006 3:42 PM PDT
"Since Microsoft isn't going to make the holiday season anyway, I think they'd be a lot better off if they took the extra time and delivered a 100 percent polished product."
-Mark Casazza

Since when has MS ever released a "100 percent polished product"? Even Apple, praised for their sucurity and clean UI, just released 26 new updates for OSX. The best we can hope for from Redmond is an OS that will run long enough to download the updates without crashing. I've always been Windows person, but Macs are looking more and more appealing.
Reply to this comment
A Lost Cause.
by ServedUp August 2, 2006 3:48 PM PDT
Vista's already a lost cause.

Microsoft should, for the interim fine tune it as much as
possible. If that means delaying it a third or fourth time, then so
be it.

If there is one thing about Microsoft, they were smart on
monopolizing Windows earlier in the game when they could,
cause its buying them time with releasing Vista. Obviously all
this time their spending, working on it, it will be a great product.
They've bought their get out of jail card and their using it to
thier advantage. Thats the mastery of Microsoft PR.

And as such..

they are such a goliath in the industry, no one can take them
down. How do I know this? Despite fierce competition from its
competitors and despite their competitors clearly having better
products, they have such a strangle-hold on this industry that I
can only conclude that this industry is Microsoft.
Reply to this comment
Not much support for any x64 OS
by mmarinello1 August 2, 2006 5:43 PM PDT
Problems: I installed Windows Vista x64 and my mouse stopped working. I needed to unplug and reconnect my USB mouse to get it to work. Windows Vista 32 bit version, my keyboard stopped working so I had to unplug and reconnect the USB keyboard.

Useless Software: I have a lot of software that I cannot use on any x64 platform. Realplayer, Nero, PowerDVD, and many other software programs aren't supported. I don't see how Vista x64 is of much use until more software support is available. Only a computer wizard can install and make these software programs work, but this is of no use for the average consumer who would never figure out how to install them.

Hardware Support: It's almost 2 years since the promise of a x64 OS, yet good luck in finding hardware support. I still have not found any support for Intel Viiv, on either Vista x64 or 32 bit.
Windows XP has 100% support. Most manufactures like Dell and HP aren't interested in any x64 OS. After a year and a half I gave up....for now.
In the meantime I am runnig Windows XP Media Center with Intel Viiv.
Reply to this comment
Vista delay again?
by jimjv2005 August 2, 2006 6:21 PM PDT
Is Bill Gates steeling Vista to prevent dumes day for people who can't afford to purchase computers to upgrade to Vista?
Reply to this comment
Does it really matter?
by qwerty75 August 2, 2006 6:51 PM PDT
Whenever it is released, it will be buggy, unstable and still very insecure.

It is based on a flawed foundation, and many of the security "improvements" are half-baked, at best.

The worst thing is that whenever it is released, it will still be years, and in a few cases decades behind other OS's.

Vista may not nail the coffin shut on MS, but it will surely slam the lid on it.
Reply to this comment
FIRE BILL GATES AND THE SOB BALMER
by chintoo2006 August 2, 2006 10:56 PM PDT
FIRE BILL GATES AND THE SOB BALMER
Reply to this comment
Vista Push Back
by garretbyrne August 3, 2006 4:26 AM PDT
Yes a 3rd Beta is needed. I mean I?ve tried the betas and as soon
as i put them on i put them back off, lol. I have read some of the
features and it sounds like it's going to be great but reading
something on paper and seeing it live is two different things. I
use both Mac OS X (Tiger) and Win XP on my laptop. And found
that the great amount of power that would be required to just
run Vista never mind apps, I'm sure they have to change this
because in all fairness who would really waste 300 and then buy
a new machine just to run it. Or buy the whole kit in one go. I
know I?m not I'm happy with XP at this time, but i would like
another beta because friends the Vista is not no where even
close to being released and if they do release it they'll just drive
that last spike into Microsoft driving a few more people away.

So Microsoft can you send yet another Beta please. I really don't
think anyone would care it's not ready for January if it's stable
that?s worth the wait.

Garret
Reply to this comment
Comparison to 95 release
by Seaspray0 August 3, 2006 7:16 AM PDT
When windows 95 was released, it was compatible with over 80% of existing PC's, it introduced revolutionary features (plug and play is my favorite), and over it's lifetime, it only went through one major update (which also introduced FAT32 as well, another favorite). It was truely extraordinary. When I compare it against what I'm seeing for vista today... I'm not impressed. One Mac user said it right about every new release chewing up more resources. How very true. I think many of us are tired of seeing the cycle of new windows requires new computer to run it. If I compare the broad spectrum of all microsoft windows operating systems, I'd have to say 98SE is the highlight. Think about what you can do with windows now compared to what you could do with 98SE. Is it really all that much more? Compare the resources 98SE took compared to now. What a difference! I wonder if anyone who works for microsoft reads these comments. If so, then "quit trying to give me whistles and bells, and give me something that runs more efficiently on the resources I currently have." I have no plans to upgrade my OS until you can. BTW, my old laptop is still running 98SE just fine and it gets lots of use. The desktop runs XP.
Reply to this comment
Too many "editions"
by ichoi1 August 3, 2006 3:44 PM PDT
I think there are six different editions of Vista and it's probably part of reasons MS can't deliver Vista on time. They should make one solid client product that can work for every user. Of course, they are probably making more profits by introducing so many "editions".
Reply to this comment
Why Vista is a Total Failure
by js92930 August 3, 2006 6:16 PM PDT
The problem with Vista isn't that it's late or that it needs more beta testing. The problem is that it's flawed in concept. Consumers aren't asking for more features. They're asking for a smaller, simpler, faster, more secure OS. Microsoft isn't listening.
Reply to this comment
Vista....A positive review
by bryanl.hearn August 4, 2006 6:30 AM PDT
Ok...I am not a proven IT bigwig, I am not a microsoft lover, I am not even a computer geek. I am computer power users, that knows how to do more then the average just web surfer, so from my perspective of using Beta 2 - build 5472, here is what I think. As for application support, the public release of Beta 2 was bad nothing worked, but with the build 5473, I have now started running it as my only OS. Most software companys are not releasing Vista Compliant versions and have not had any problems running core apps. As for Games, I can not comment.

First a much improved GUI. It has a much sleeker design, and I love the new start menu. I liek the Ctrl-alt-del features and how when I roll my mouse over taskbar itmes it shows me a preview. I think the Areo glass feature is great. there is much more I like too, just don't want this to get to long. Also the new file menu system is awesome, took a litle getting use to, but now that I am I love it.

Second, Stability....I have not had the OS crash on me once. NOT ONCE, been using this current build for 2 weeks now and have installed everything I can. No OS crashes. Yes, some apps wont install and work, but thats not MS's problem, thats the app companies issues.

Third, Performance. I get the same performance if not better on my machine then I did with Win XP. I have a Dell 8200 with a 2 Ghz chip and a gig of RAM with a ATI Radeon Video Card and a Audigy 2 sound card. Also with build 5472, installation time was the fasest of any MS OS I have ever installed.

Does MS still have work to do, yes. But overall, Vista a great improvement over XP. I use XP at work and really love using vista at home. Now I havent used Linux, or Mac OSX, but what MS has over all the other is that it is easy to use, and very intutitive. I play with a mac or linux and I am lost. I know if I used it for a few hours, I would be fine, but why, MS has the most supported apps and I can do everything I need to.
Reply to this comment
Still trying to get a Mac-like GUI...
by Kings X Rocks! August 4, 2006 6:47 AM PDT
I'm not a Mac user, but I do have the luxury of a Mac at work for R&D and support. [I've invested too many years in the Windows family to switch now]

IMO, Vista is simply an attempt to get a classy Mac-like interface, not to improve on OS efficiency. I doubt if Vista was *completly* reworked from the ground up, which means plenty of "bolt-ons" to accomplish the changes, which just add to the hardware requirements.

You gotta admit that the Mac inteface has always shown what a really class-act GUI should be.

Go ahead, admit it.
Reply to this comment
Hurry Up.......................For More Problems!
by sleepingcobra1 August 5, 2006 4:45 AM PDT
I can't believe some people will think Vista will be better than other OS. Vista will have problems and you wil have to start downloading patch after patch after pach if not "patched patches" I don't even want Vista. I have Windows XP Pro and i don't want Vista "untill" i absolutely have to use it. Stay with the OS you have now. Robert
Reply to this comment
More vendors have preinstalled Linux now
by cyber_rigger August 5, 2006 4:24 PM PDT
http://lxer.com/module/forums/t/23168/
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